The.xvi. Chapter. The aunsvvere to the obieccion

Anthony. EYther I sayd not Cosyn, or els ment I not to say, that for an vndoubted rule worldlye prosperitie wer alway displeasaunt to god, or tribulacion euermore wholesome to euerye man. For wel wot I that our lord geueth in this world vnto eyther sorte of folke, eyther sorte of fortune. E[…]facit solem suum ori[…]i super bonos et malos, et pluit super iustos et iniustos. He maketh his sunne to shine both vpō the good and the bad, and his raine to raine both on the iuste and on […]he vniust. And on the other side, Flagellat omnem filium quem recipit: he scourgeth euery sonne that he receiueth. And yet he beateth not onely good folke that he loueth, but Multa flagella peccatoris too. There are manye scourges for sinners also: he geueth euyl folke good fortune in this worlde, both to call them by kindenes, and if they therby come not, the more is their vnkindnes: and yet where welth wil not bring thē, he geueth thē sometime sorow. And some yt in prosperitie can not to God crepe foreward, in tribulaciō toward him they runne a pace. Multiplicate sunt infirmitates corum postea accelerauerunt. Theyr infirmities were multyplyed (sayeth the Prophet) and after that they made has[…]e. To some that are good men god sendeth welth here also, and they geue him great thanke for his gift, and he rewardeth them for ye thāke to. To some good folke he sēdeth sorow, & they thanke him therof to. If god should geue the goodes of this world onely to euyll folke, thā would men wene y• god were not the lord therof. If god would geue ye goodes only to good mē, thā would folke take occasiō to serue him but for them. Some will in welth fall into folye. Homo qum in honore esset non intellexit, comparatus est iumentis insipientibus, & similis factus est ills. Whā mā was in honoure, his vnderstanding fayled him, than was he cōpared with beastes and made lyke vnto them. Some man wyth tribulacion wil fal into sinne, and therfore saith the prophet: Non relinquet dominus virgam peccatorum super sortem iustorum, vt non ex […]endant iustiad iniquitatem manus suas. GOD wil not leaue the rodde of wycked men vpon the lotte of righteous men, lest the righteous peraduenture happe to extende and stretche out their handes to iniquitie. So say I not naye, but that in eyther state, welth or tribulacion maie be matter of vertue and matter of vice also: but this is the poynt loe, that standeth here in question betewene you and me: not whither euery prosperyte be a perylous token, but whither continuall welth in thys world wythout anye triblacion be a fearefull sygne of Goddes indignacion. And therefore thys marcke that we must shoote at, set vp wel in our sight, we shal now mete for the shoote and consider howe neare toward, or howe farre of, your arrowes are from the pricke.

☞Vincent. Some of my boltes vncle wyll I take vp my self, and pretely put them vnder your belte againe[…] For some of them I see wel be not worth the metynge, and no great merueyle, though I shoote wyde while I somewhat mystake the marke.

☞Antony. Those yt make toward ye marke & light farre to short, whē ye shote is meatte, shal I take vp for you.

1 To proue that perpetual welth shouldbe no euyl token, you saye fyrste, that for princes and prelates and euery man for other, we praye all for perpetuall prosperyte, and that in the comen prayers of the church too.

2 Thā saye you secondly that if prosperite were so perylous, and tribulacion so profytable, euery man ought then to praye god to send other sorowe.

3 Thirdely you furnishe your obiections with ensā ples of Salomon, Iob, and Abraham.

4 And fourthly in thende of al, you proue by experiēce of our owne tyme daylye before our face, that some welthy folke are good, and some nedye verye naught. That las[…]e bolte I thincke loe, that syth I saye the same my self, you be content to take vp, it lyeth so farre wyde.

☞Vincent. That wyll I wyth a good wyll vncle.

☞Anthony. Well, doe so good Cosin, and we shall mete for the remanante. Fyrste muste you Cosyn be sure that you looke wel to the marke, and that can you not doe, but if you knowe what thinge tribulacion is. For syth that it is one of the chiefe thynges that we pryncypally speake of but if you consydre well what that is, you maye mysse the marke agayne. I suppose nowe that you wyl agree that tribulation is euery suche thinge as troubleth and greueth a man eyther in bodye or mind: and is, as it were the pricke of a thorne a bramble or a bryre thrust into hys fleshe or into his mynd: and su[…]rly Cosin the pricke that verie sore pricketh the minde as farre almost passeth in paine the griefe that payneth the bodye, as dothe a thorne that styckyng in the heart, passe and excede in payne, the thorne that is thruste in the hele.

Nowe Cosin if tribulacion be this that I call it, than shall you sone consider this, that there be moe kindes of tribulacion, than you peraduenture thought on before. And ther vpon it foloweth also, that sythe euerye kynde of trybulacion is an interrupcion of welth and prosperitie, (which is but of wel[…]h, an other name) may be discontinewed by moe wayes than yowe would afore haue wente: Than saye I this vnto you Cosin, that syth tribulacion is not onelye suche panges as payne the body, but euerye trouble also that greueth the mynde, manye good men haue manye tribulacyons that euerye man markethe not, and consequently theyr welthe interrupted therewythe when other mē are not ware. For trowe you Cosin that the temptacyons of the deuyll the worlde and the fleshe solicyting the minde of a good man vnto sinne, is not a great inward trouble & secrete griefe to his heart. To such wretches as care not for theyr conscience, but like vnreasonable beastes folowe theyr foule affeccions, many of these temptaciōs be no trouble at all, but matter of theyr bodily pleasure. But vnto him Cosin that standeth in dreade of god, tribulacion of temptaciō is so paynefull, that to be rydde therof[…] or sure of the victory therin (be his substaunce neuer so great) he would gladly geue more then half. Now if he that careth not for god thinke this trouble but a trifle, and with such tribulacion prosperitie not interrupted: let him cast in his minde if hym selfe happe vpon a feruent longing for the thing which geat he cannot (as a good man will not) as percase hys pleasure of some certaine good woman that wil not be naught, and than let him tel me whether the ruffle of his desier shal so torment his minde, as al the pleasures that he can take besyde, shal for lacke of yt one, not please him of a pynne. And I dare be bolde to warraunte him that the payne in resisting, and ye great feare of falling y• many a good man hath in his temtaciō, is an anguishe and a grief euery deale as great as his.

Nowe saie I farther Cosin, that if this be true, as in very dede true it is, that such trouble is tribulaciō, and therby cōsequently an interrupciō of prosperous welth: no man precysely meaneth to pray for other to kepe him in continual prosperitie without any maner of discōtinuāce or chaūge in this world, so y• prayer wt out other cōdiciō added or imployed, were inordinate & were very childishe. For it were to praye yt eyther they should neuer haue tēptaciō, or els if yt they had they might folow it & fulfil theyr affecciō. Who dare good Cosin for shame or for synne for hym selfe, or for anye mā els make this maner kind of praier? Besides this Cosin ye church you wote well aduiseth euerye man to fast & watch, & prai, both for tamīg of his fleshly lustes, & also to mourne and lament for his sinne before committed and to bewaile his offences done against god, and as they did at the citie of Niniue, and as the prophete Dauid did for theyr sinne put affliccion to their fleshe, and whan a manne so dooeth Cosin, is this no tribulacion to hym because he dooeth it hymselfe? For I wote well you would agree that it were, if an other man did it againste his will. Than is tribulacion, you wote well tribulacion styll, thoughe it be taken well in worthe: yea and though it be taken to with very righ[…] good wyl, yet is payn you wote wel payn, & therfore s[…] is it thoughe a manne dooe it himselfe. Than sith th[…] chur[…]he aduiseth euery manne to take tribulacion for his synne, whatsoeuer wordes you fynde in any prayer, they neuer meane (you maye bee faste and sure) to praye god kepe euerye good manne nor euerye badde man nether, frō euery maner kind of tribulaciō. Now he that is not in some kynde of tribulacion, as peraduenture in sicknes[…] or in losse of goodes, is not yet out of tribulacion, yf he haue his ease of bodye or of mind vnquieted and therby his welthe interrupted with an other kinde of tribulacion[…] as is eyther temptacion to a good man, or voluntarye affliccion: eyther of bodye by penaunce, or of mynde by contricion and heauines for his syn & offence agaynst god. And thus I say, yt for precise perpetual welthe and prosperitie in this world, yt is to say, for the perpetuall lacke of all trouble and al tribulacion, there is no wise man that ether praieth for himself or for ani man els, & thus answere I your first obiecciō. Now before I medle wt your secōd your third wil I ioine to this. For vpō this answer, will ye soluciō of your ensāples cōueniētly depend. As for Salomō was as you sai al his daies a merueilous welthy king, & much was he beloued wt god, I wote wel in yt beginning of his raigne: but yt the fauor of god perseuered him, as his prosperitie did yt cannot I tel. And therfore wil I not warrant it, but surely we se yt his cōtinuall wel[…]h[…] made him fal first into such wantō foli, in multiplying wyues to an horrible noumber, contrary to the commaundemente of god, geuen in the lawe of Moyses: and secondly taking to wife among other, such as were infidels contrary to an other commaundement of gods written law also, that finallye by the meane of his miscreant wife, he fel into maintenaūce of Idolatrie himself: and of this find we no amendment or repētance, as we find of his father. And therfore though he were buryed where his father was, yet whether he wente to the rest that his father did[…] throughe some secrete sorow for his sinne at last, yt is to say, by some kind of tribulacion, I cannot tel: & am content therefore to trust wel, and pray god he did so, but surely we be not sure & therfore then sample of Salomō can very litle serue you, for you might as well lay it for a profe, yt god fauoureth Idolatrie, as yt he fauoureth prosperitye: for Salomō was you wote wel in bothe. As for Iob, sith our questiō hāgeth vpō prosperitie perpetual, y• welthe of Iob yt was wt so great aduersitie so sore interrupted, can as your self seeth serue you for no ensāple. And yt god gaue him here in this world al thing double that he lost, litle toucheth my matter, which deny not prosperitie to be gods gift, & geuē to sum good mē too: namely such as haue tribulaciō too. But in Abrahā Cosī I suppose is al your chief hold, because yt you not onely shewe riches & prosperitie perpetual in hī throw ye course of al his whole life in this world, but yt after his death also. La […]are yt poore mā yt liued in tribulaciō, & died for pure hū ger & thirst, had after his death his place of cōfort and rest in Abrahā ye welthy riche mans bosome. But here must you cōsider yt Abrahā had not such cōtinuall prosperitie, but yt it was discōtinued wt diuers tribulaciōs.

1 Was it not[…]īg to him trow you, to leaue his own coū trey, and at gods sending to goe into a straunge land, whiche god promised him and his sede for euer? but in all his whole lyfe he gaue himselfe neuer a foote.

2 Was it no trouble. y• his Cosin Loth & himself were fain to part company, because their seruauntes could not agree together?

3 Though he recouered Loth again from ye.iii. kīges, was his taking no trouble to him trowe you in the meane while?

4 Was the destrucciō of the fiue cities no heauines to his heart? A man would wene yes that redeth in ye story what laboure he made to saue them.

5 His heart was I dare say in no litle sorow, when he was faine to let Abimelech ye king haue his wife, whō (though god prouided to kepe vndefiled & turned al to welth) yet was it no litle wo to him in the meane time.

6 What cōtinual grief was it to his heart many a long daye that he had no child of his owne bodi begotten? he that doubteth thereof shall finde it in Genesis of his own moone made to god.

7 No man doubteth but Ismael was greate comforte vnto him at his byrthe, and was it no griefe than, when he must cast out the mother and the chylde both?

8 Isaac that was the chylde of Promyssyon: although god kept his lyfe, that was vnlooked for, yet whyle the louyng father bounde hym and went about to behead hym, and offre him vp in sacrifice, who but himself can conceiue what heauines his hert had thā? I woulde wene in my mynde (because you speake of lazare) that lazars owne death panged him not so sore. Thā as laza[…]us paine was paciently borne, so was Abrahams taken not onely pacientely[…] (but whiche is a thing muche more meritorious) of obedience willingly. And therefore, though Abraham had not as he dyd in dede farre excell lazare in merite of reward, for many other thynges besyde, and specially for that he was a speciall Patriarche of the fayth, yet had he farre passed him, euen by the merite of tribulacion well taken here for gods sake to. And so serueth for your purpose no man lesse then Abraham. But now good Cosin, let vs looke a litle lenger here vpon the riche Abraham & lazare the poore, and as we shall see lazare set in welth some what vnder the riche Abraham: so shal we se another ryche man lye full lowe beneath lazare crying and calling out of his fyrie couche, that lazare myghte with a droppe of water fallyng from his fingers end, a litle coole and refresh the tippe of his burning tong. Consider well nowe what Abraham aunswered to the riche wretche. Fili recordare quia recepisti bona in vita tua & lazarus similiter mala, nune autem hic consolatur, tu vero cruciaris. Sōne, remēber that thou hast in thy lyfe receiued welthe, and lazare in lyke wyse payne, but nowe receiueth he comforte, and thou sorow, payne and torment. Christe describeth his wealthe and hys prosperitie, gaye and softe apparell wyth royall delicate fare, continuallye daye by daye. Epulabatur (saieth our Sauior)[…] quotidie splendide. He did fare royally eueri day, his welth was cōtinual, lo no time of tribulacion betwene. And Abraham telleth hym the same tale that he had takē his welth in this world, and Lazarus likewise his pain: & that they had now chaunged eche to ye cleane contrary: poore Lazar frō tribulacion into welth, & the riche man from his continual prosperite into perpetual pain. Here was laid expresselye to Lazare no very greate vertue by name nor to this riche glotton no great heynous crime, but the taking of his continuall ease and pleasure withoute any tribulaciō or griefe, wherof grewe slouth & negligence to thinke vpō the poore mans paine. For that euer him selfe saw Lazarus and wist hym dye for hunger at his dore yt layd neither Christ nor Abraham to his charge. And therfore Cosin this story lo of which by occasiō of Abraham and Lazare you putte me in remembraūce, well declareth what perell is in continuall worldly welth, and contrarywyse what comforte cōmeth of tribulacion. And thus as your other ensamples of Salomon and Iob nothyng for the matter further you: So your ensample of riche Abraham and poore Lazarus haue not a litle hindred you.