The.xxiii. chapyter

YEt putteth thys pacyfyer a thyrde kynd of thynkers suche a kynde as I neuer to my remēbraūce haue herde of before, that is to wytte of suche as purposely saye euyll and opēly speke heresye, and for all that thynke well. And those he sayeth are polytyke, whyche to pull awaye ryches fro the chyrche, speke agaynst all thynge that any thynge brynge into it / as agaynste prayenge for soules in purgatory, grauntyng of pardons, pylgrymages, makynge of lawes, foūding of chaūteries makynge of brothereheddes and many mo.

And though they speke agayn[…]e all these thynges / yet he sayth they knowe well inough that all these thinges be good & maye be well vsed. But bycause they brynge ryches into the chyrch / therfore he sayth though they knowe them for good & thynke them […]ood, yet they speke agaynst […] […]ll of polycy / not agaynst […] […]ses onely, but also agaynst the very thinges selfe. For of those y• speke agaynste thabuses onely, he putteth another sorte bysyde these men whome he calleth for thys poynt so polytyke. And he sayeth that those that onely speke agaynste thabusys, do better and haue more grace / but yet that excludeth not ye wote well, but that the tother may be good inough, & haue grace inough to, though not so mych.

Thus hath thys pacyfyer put thre kyndes of folke that wold haue the goodys taken from the chyrche.

The fyrst, of those that wold take all and leue nothynge. And those men he sayth haue a good zele.

The secunde, of those that wolde leue suffycyent & take a waye the remanaunt. And those men haue he saith good dyscrecyon.

The thyrde kynde he calleth those, whych rather then the chyrche sholde haue any thynge, lette not to speke agaynste good thynges. And those men though they speke openly platte and playne heresye / yet he denyeth not to be wyse mē & vse a good polycy.

But now where as they denye purgatory / thys is as me thynketh an […]uyll polycy, for wythdrawynge of offrynges fro y• clergy, to withdraw therwyth our almoyse frome the pore lay people to / and yet that wurste is of all from the sely soules them selfe, that lye there and pytuousely crye in payne.

By this polycy ye wote wel y• these polityke folke might impūgne in generall y• affeccion of geuynge any thynge in almoyse. For that affeccyon ye wote well bryngeth in y• yere somewhat into some parte of the clergy. And well ye wote that syth the bylyefe of purgatory and other of those thynges agaynst whyche these polytyke men so speke, be playn and open trew this reueled by god / and the contrary bylyefe is by the hole catholyke chyrche playnely determyned for heresy / and syth men can not know that a mā byleueth the trewth in his herte, yf he hold agaynste it openly wyth hys mouth / & those therfore that speke heresyes, euery good man that hereth them is boū den to denoūce or accuse thē / and the bysshoppes are bounden vppon theyr wordes proued to put them to penaunce and reforme them / whyche yf they refuse or fall in relapse, the bysshoppe is bounde to delyuer them, and all good temporall gouernours are than bounden to punyshe them: yf euery other man dyde on all sydes the parte of a good crysten man, it appereth that the polycy of those whome thys pacyfyer calleth so politike, wolde within a whyle proue a pore polycy.

How be it what mynd this pacyfyer hath hym selfe cōcerning these poyntes / hym selfe declareth that he byleueth y• right waye & the trew. whych I am very gladde to here / & for my parte as helpe me god I veryly trust he fayneth not therin, but as a trew chrysten man veryly sayth as he thynketh. And yet is not euery mā therin of my mynde. And therfore it wolde be wronge yf euery some say & euery some thynke, sholde serue to bryng a man in hatered or obloquy. For surely some say that they thinke, that yf some men may as he sayth of polycy fayne them selfe heretykes, and yet bylyue full truely for all that in theyr hertes / some one man may myche better fayne hym self for polycy full catholyke, and yet in hys herte byleue the whyle full falsely. But what so euer some men say or some men thynke, in that mater I neuer wyll thynke that a man byleueth other wyse than he sayth he doth, but yf hym selfe shold by some other wordes or dedes of hys own, declare of his mynde the contrary. And as I wyll not agaynste a mannys wordes spokē accordyng to the ryght sayth, thinke that he byleueth wronge: surely so can I not thynke that he whyche in hys wordes openly inueyeth agaynste good and faythfull thynges, and dyspyseth trew poyntes of the comon knowē catholyke fayth, doth in hys hart secretely thynke and byleue ryghte / but yf he were amonge Paynems that wold for fere of payn compell hym to renye hys fayth, whyche were yet in that case dampnable to hys soule, and therfore is here amonge chrysten men where no suche force compelleth hym, but vppon hys petell forbedeth hym, of very good reason dampnable to hys body.