The.xxiiii. chapyter

The messenger make the obieccyons agaynste the author / in that he counceyled the student of scrypture to brynge thartycles of our faythe wyth hym for a specyall rule to conster the scrypture by. And ye author confyrmythe hys counsayle geuen in that byhalfe / declarynge yt wyth out that rule / men may sone fall in to greate errours in ye study of holy scrypture.

wyth this your frende held as he sayd hym selfe somewhat cōtet that reasō was not so greate an enmy to fayth as she semyd. But yet he thought that he shuld haue nede rather to be well brydelyd / thā to bere much rule in ye interpretacyon of scrypture. But as for ye tother poynt yt we shulde nedys bryng the fayth wyth vs all redy / as a rule to lerne the scrypture by / whē we come to the scrypture to lerne the faythe by / that he thought in no wyse conuenyent / but a thyng he sayd which like as if we wold go make the cart to draw the horse. well quod I wee shall see anon whether the carte drawe the horse or the horse the carte. Or whether we be yet hapely so blinde that we se not well whic[…] is the carte. which is the horse. Firste quod I tell me how olde wolde ye ye one were ere he come to ye study of scripture. By my faythe he. I wolde haue a chrysten mannys child begyn therin very yōg / and therin contynew all his lyfe. In good fayth quod I yt lyke I not amys / so that ye doo not mene that ye wolde haue him all his life lerne nothing els: And yet that could I suffer to & allow ryghte well in some. But yet if he did neuer in his life lerne oughte els / how olde think ye that he shuld be or he lerned the articles of his belefe in ye bible? I can nott redely tell quod he / for I haue not sene it assayed. well quod I sith we be not sure how long it wolde be in lernynge there / were it not beste then yt for ye whyle he were tought hys crede before in his own mother tong? I demē not y• q he / yt he shuld conne hys crede byfore / because euery chrystē mannys chylde by the law shuld know hys fayth as sone as he coud / but I say he shuld not therwith take vppon hym to iudge and examyne holy scrypture therby. well quod I let thys crysten chylde of ours alone for a whyle. And let vs cōsyder yf there were a good old ydolater that neuer had hard in all his lyfe any thyng of our belefe or of other god thē only the man in y• mone / whō he had watched ād worshypped euery frosty night. If thys mā myght sodēly haue y• hole byble turned into his own tong & rede yt ouer / thynke ye that he shuld therby lerne all the artycles of y• fayth? I thynk quod he y• he myght. Thīk ye so q I? I put case yt he beleuyd yt all y• boke were lyes? Mary q he that may he by y• book hym self lern ye cōtrary. For the boke in tellyng hys tale affyrmyth hys tale & techyth yt to be trew. ye say very trothe quod I if yt were all one to rede a thyng & lerne a thynge. But now myght there be an other boke made also wyth lesse wonders & fewer & therby lesse vnlykly / ād yett all vntrewe. And how should hys mynde geue hym than that thys boke tellyng so incredible wonders shuld be trew? Nay quod he that thyng must he nedys beleue or els he can parceyue nothynge. well quod I then is there one poynt of fayth one gret lessō to be lernyd without the boke / that must be lernyd sum where ether by god or mā / or els y• hole boke wyll do vs lytyll seruice. And of whom we shall lern that / we shall se herafter. But now suppose that thys olde ydolater were thorouly perswadyd in hys mynd yt all the boke were trew / thynk you thā that he shuld fynd out theryn all the artycles of our fayth? I thynk quod he that he shuld Thynk ye so q I? beyt so than. But thynk ye that he shall fynde them out[…] all in a weke? Nay quod he yt can he not do. well quod I than sith he shall not at the lest wyse fynde them out all on a day / let vs leue hym a lytyll while in sekyng / & we shall retorne agayn after to hym and loke what he shall haue founden. And in the meane season we shall go loke agayn vppon oure good lytell godsō the boy parde yt we crystened ryght now & taught hym his crede & sett hym to scrypture. were it nede y• thys chyld knew no more of hys fayth but his crede before he go to scripture? Me thynketh quod he that yt were ynoughe. Be it so than quod I.

whatt yf yt shoulde fortune hym to fynde some text of scripture that shuld seme to him to be cōtrary to his crede. As for ensample yf he happened vppō the redyng of these wordys / Dij estis & filij excelsi omnes / Goddys be ye all & the chyldern of the hye god. what yf he wolde wene that syth in these wordys it ys sayd all good mē be the chyldern of god / oure sauyour Cryste were not goddys onely begoten sonne / but hys sōne in such wyse as god by y• prophet callyth all good men? That coud he not thynke q he. For he shuld in […] other partes of scrypture fynd many placys yt shuld shew hym well the contrary.

well sayd quod I & very truth. But now in the mene tyme wyll ye that he shal beleue as yt text shall seme to soūd to hym agaynst hys crede tyll he haue found a nother texte in scrypture that answeryth yt & seemyth to hym to saye more playnly ye cōtrary? Nay quod he not one houre. For he seeth / yt thogh other good men be callyd goddys chyldern & goddys / yet as they be not very goddys / so be they not goddꝭ very naturall chyldern by generacyon but by acceptacyon / where as the crede sayeth of our sauyour / that he is goddes onely bygotten sone / that sygnyfyeth him to be hys sōne by generacyon. That is quod I very trew and well and resonably consyderyd / and accordynge vnto the very ryght fayth. But now consyder that ye make hym by and by fall to the squaryng of his stones lyke that slowthfull masō that ye spake of wyth hys leden rule. For now ye make hym to examyne the trouth of thys texte of the psalme by the artycle of the faythe / whych he brought wyth hym / and by a collecciō and discourse of reason. And so forthwyth ye finde both these rules necessarie to the discussiō of scrypture. Of whych twayne ye wolde in the byginnyng admit nether nother. But now goo ferther. what yf he wolde vppon thys texte / homines & iumenta sal uabis deus / God thou shalt saue both men and bestys / wene that bestys had immortall soulis as menne haue / and that mā and beste shuld be both saued at laste / and so y• no dedely sinne shuld be ponyshed wyth euerlasting payne / […]ll he cam to other textys that shulde proue well the contrarye / were ye beste or ellys were it better that bysyde hys crede he had knowlege bifore of these artycles of our feythe / that onely oure soules be in mortall and not bestys al so / And that ye payne of hell shalbe for synners euer lastīg / And that he may therby wyth reason ioyned therto / perceyue that this text / Thou shalte saue bothe men and bestꝭ / is mente by som other kinde of sauing and preseruyng here in thys world / and not of bryngyng both to heuen? All thys may he know quod he by scripture selfe well I […]ough. That wot I well q I. And yet as playne as christe speketh of hell ī the gospell / Origene for all y•/which neyther was a nawghty mā nor vnlerned in scrypture / could not so clerly se it but that he sayed the contrary. And toke the wordes of Chryste in a wrōg sense. And wolde perauenture wythe one that wolde stykke onely vppon ye the wordys of scripture leuyng ye right sense therof / whych god and hys holly spryt hath tawght his churche / brynge hym to a baye therin / that he shuld be fayne not our chylde onely / but also a well elderly man and in scripture well forwarde / to take hym in conclusyon to y• fayth of Chrystys church. Now if our childe sholde rede on the texte of scrypture wythout care of the commē tis / and wythout enny further enstruccyon of the poyntis of our faythe than be specyfyd in our commē […]rede / made in the begynyng as a brefe remēbrans by the appostellys / not settyng out in so short a thyng and clerely declaring all that we be bounden to bileue / albeit yt he shuld well finde in scripture many playne and open textys wherbye ye godhed of our sauyour and his egalyte wt his father may well & suffycyētly be prouyd / yet were he not vnlykly by such other textys as seme to shew hym to be lesse then his father / to fall into ye sect and heresy of ye Arryanys. And agaynst those other textys prouyng his egall godhed / to deuyse such false glosys as they did / where as being before taught and confyrmed by the fayth of y• chyrch y• our sauyour is one god and one egall substaūce wt his father / shall well perceyue and vnderstand therby / yt all y• textis yt seme to make him lesse / be nothyng to be vnderstanden of hys godhed but of his manhod onely. As when we comenly speke of our self ād of our owne nature / and say wee shall dye & wormys ete vs vpp & turne all to dust / we mene all thys by our body ōly and nothyng entend thereby to denye the immortalyte of our soule. we may not dyne to day yf I shulde reken you the tenth parte of such thyngys as we muste nedys vppon losse of heuyn byleue / whyche neyther oure chylde wyth hys only crede / and mych lesse our olde idolater wythout crede shuld so finde oute by scrypture / but that they were bothe well lykely to take the scrypture to the wrong parte / excepte we take wt vs for a rule of interpretacyon the articles of our fayth.